Yes, I'm a fan of Muse. I bought Absolution last week, and listened to
it close on a dozen times. There's one song title, track 13, Thoughts
of a Dying Athiest. And it got me thinking, being the life-long athiest
I am (let us not be philosophical and claim to be agnostic), it got me
thinking. What will be my final thoughts? I'm going to die someday,
when I don't know, and there will be a final everything. A final
breath, a final sight, a final word. What will they be? Will I even
have time to have thoughts? I could die tomorrow, walking across the
road and be hit by one of the teenage drivers who travel too fast up
the school road. Or I may live for a number of decades ahead,
eventually wallowing in decrepitude and self-pity, until I pass away in
my sleep, oblivious to my surroundings. Let us assume I'm sufferring
from a terminal illness, seeing as I, like many other teenagers,
consider myself to be invincible it seems like a good place to start.
So I'll be lying in a hospital bed, knowing that my life is about to
pass. I am about to lose that final spark which make sme human, which
gives me my thoughts. I'll be dead, for the rest of time. My death
isn't going to end, and I know that. What do I think? Will I accept it,
or fight, terrified at the nothing in front of me? Were I to die from a
prolonged illness, I would be a lot older than I am now, and most
likely more emotionally mature than I am now. When I die, I wont know
about it, it wont bother me, so why worry? Because I don't really know
what happens. And this is where the title comes in. As an athiest,
I believe that once life is over, it remains so. But what if I'm wrong?
If science today is acceptable, such as the idea everything is made
from individual atoms, that the world is controlled by unseen waves,
why is the idea of God so unlikely? There was a point in time where
these were created. A point where forces, states, matter was made. Even
time itself must of had a starting point, in order to exist does one
not have to begin? So when our consciousness came into being, something
must have created that. It didn't come from nowhere. Or maybe it did,
we don't know. But if these ideas of existence are so readily accepted,
why not religion? Surely it's as outlandish as 'science'. So, as
I'm dying, I begin to think this. I spent my life not having a faith
because I couldn't handle the thought of something considered
irrational. And as I lived my life, not bothering with belief, was it
worth it in the end? When I die, will I discover I was wrong all along,
that there is an unseen
entity, be it all controlling or not. Would my lifetime of not trusting
in it be punished? Or would I be rewarded for living my life as I chose
to? So as I'm dying, I think about the options I have to believe
in. I either die, and am gone, or I am reborn, I live on in a
supernatural state. Which one do I rather? I must admit, at a younger
age I would of loved immortality, like all youngsters, but now it
terrifies me. It is forever, my conscious state would never leave.
Would I want this? No. Would I rather all that was left of me to be
matter, a dead body, a mere 'thing' considered to be fearful and
disgusting. Evetually memory and thought of me would erase, and Hannah
Salt would be no more. Cease to be anything but a name on documents,
when those too, are eventually lost, or destroyed. I stop existing. The
world was unchanged by me, lives were unchanged by me, no impact of my
life is made. So what was my life worth?
I could possibly find
solace in this fact. My life could become worse, and emotions would get
the beter of rationality. Suicide is always a means of death, and not
impossible. Were my method slower, would I suddenly panic, or be calm?
Would I have second thoughts? There's no way of knowing, unless I
attempt suicide, and despite my emotions towards death, the natural
instinct in me, the one that tells me to keep breathing, and thinking,
wins.
What are we here for? I personally feel we are here as
part of the evolvement of DNA molecules. As they progress, we come
along with them, supplying a host, as it were. A means for the
molecules to reproduce, to continue surviving. It's a fairly well known
theory, and I find it to be the most logical. What makes us 'us'? What
gives that one elusive spark that tells us we;re alive, that we thing,
that we're not mere objects? Does life not seem so pointless to have
these mysteries only to never be solved after death?
I'm in a strange mood. If you read this far, kudos to you. If not, it doesn't matter because you wont receive this message.
I tell you, Eliot knew what he was talking about when he said "I am not
Prince Hamlet, nor was meant to be". We're not creatures of
magnificance and understanding, we're pitiful glimpses of the Universe.
Well, I hope I can answer in an equally interesting manner to this deep blog!
Personally, I feel that ultimately, humanity is defined as a whole because we can think of the ideas of "Us" and "Them" and seperate them. We define things, we change them, and we generally want more.
Another thing I feel about people in general is that we are basically governed by two main drives - "fear", and "greed". I feel that whatever a person does can be broken down into these two main impulses. Either they don't want something to happen, and do something about it, or they do something because they want something at the end of it. Seems obvious.
In the end. I believe that what you believe in changes the Universe for you. Specifically, if we just say there are 6 billion people on Earth, then there are 6 billion different versions of the Universe. For example, if you didn't know Australia existed, and you'd never been there, nor anyone told you, would it exist? It wouldn't. But to someone else, who did know about it, it would exist. Therefore, if you believe in life after death or something, then sure, it happens. But if you've never heard of the concept then nothing happens.
That's what seperates us from animals as well - we worry about tomorrow rather than live in today.
Thoughts of a Dying atheist is a right ch00n. That was quite a read for a bored Friday night. I think that the "final thought" is a bit like the "what do you do if you die tomorrow?" I think you'd do nothing. You'd spend so much tme trying to think of the perfect day, thinking about death in itself and you would do nothing. I think there would be no real thoughts, as for me certainly I'd probably (I'll never know, I'll only get one chance, and certainly won't be thinking of ages ago, when I thought what would I be thinking at this time) be striving as hard as I could to fight death, to clutch onto that last spark of life.
BTW have a kudo (not sure what one is, but I assume it's good).
''To the well organised mind, death is just the next big adventure'' - Albus Dumbledore
''To die will be an awfully big adventure'' - Aristotle
Incidentally, i am not scared of death as i recognise the fact that one day i must face it, however this is not to say im willing to die, far from it. My point is, i couldnt and cant stand the idea of fearing death and being paranoid, as tis not the way to live life. Enjoy it to the full and after all
''What will come will come and when it does ill be ready'' - darthbuttchins adaptation of a quote of Hagrid.
Ok so the reason for the Harry Potter quotes? Ive been reading the series, i admit lol. But they good quotes....
Well, hey, if your thinking about religion so much, check out the Christian Guitarists group. Its in my profile. Any one of us would be happy to talk to you about it.
It made me also think of "Our Time is Running Out", which is another absolutely brilliant track. Actually, Absolution is such a terrific album I think I must go listen to it right now.
Wow that was deep, but find my self thinking the same things ( I just seem to lack the ability to write out such a long post. ).
To be honest I figured the easiest thing to do is just let it be. Enjoy the here and now, I hope there is something bigger out there, but maybe there isn't however without knowing i'm not gonna try to worry too much over that.
That was a really interesting read. And +1 to Zeppelinpage4, I think we shouldn't worry too much and just enjoy what we're given. But hats off to you Han, not many people can write something as thought provoking (and long) as that
What I found the most interesting was the fear of eternal life. I too fear this almost above all else. As a kid growing up in a fairly religious family I heard my Pastor say that yaddayaddayadda Forgiveness and you will receive Eternal life. I went home and thought about that, and it scared the shit out of me. Of course as an eight year old what made me scared was the boredom. You live forever what happens when you finish everything you've ever wanted to do? And if life in heaven is so great, will there even be anything to do? Now I fear, like you, the endlessness of it. There is no end! And as a human to try and fathom something, as having no end... how can one do that?
I think having a consciousness is about realizing the end, working toward a mean, a purpose, whether self-imposed or of a higher power, regardless. What happens when that end is no more? When you realize that tomorrow, you have no chance of dieing, there is no point in improvement of your body or soul because you've reached what many humans strive all their lives to be? You've reached the pinnacle, the apex, the acme, the climax, of all human existence, what next? You've reached the top where is there to go? You now have to live, in some frame of mind or another, as a meaningless entity, for all time. There is no end to your meaningless, unlike when you feel your life has no meaning you know eventually it will end, eventually you will find meaning or your will to live will be extinguished and you will die. There is no chance of meaning because, you see no end, no little voice saying live well, you only have another 70 years at best. It's scary to think that there is only 70 years to live. Yet, it is reassuring to know that there is a limit and that you are working toward an end, a goal, and I think that life's goal, for me, is to die happy. But, in heaven, where does this goal run to? What is it replaced with? Eternal life? How can eternal life be a reward, it seems to me a more fitting reward would be to crushed into oblivion after death. As s
I know you've had some cut off, but that's the exact thought I've had for many years. I've always been terrified of living forever and simply being bored.
wow, got some smart deep philosophical people in here. haha
i used to think about stuff like that when i was a little boy back in the day.
i never thaught about eternal life i almsot had the opposite it used to trip me righ tout that after you die...thats it forever you sit there in the ground decomposing (too young to understand any type of reincarnation or anything of the sort) and its for ever....and ever, no end. we are never to experience life again? not meant to go one for more?
then when i was a little bit older, i consicered to be the purpose of life (not the meaning)
and thats to reproduce...its the absolute most basic of all urges a human can have.
and its simple enough. it satisfies the baser lust, and feed your survival...the more you do it the more your name lives on.. but like you said...eventually yopur name will end......then what?
I think about and discuss this with my friends very often. We're a depressing bunch of teenagers... Anyways, thanks again for interesting blogging. I'll give you more kudos if I can, or is there a limit? I'm quite new to this.
Here lies the Atheist: All dressed up with no place to go.
Having read ur other blogs on religion, i have come to a new conclusion and wish for you to disregard my earlier comments. Although i still have my beliefs and believe what i have written is true, i have realsied what you are saying.
In essence, my conclusion is that what you are saying is that at the end of your life, you will enter the ground and decompose and thats the end of you, right?
and whatever you do in this life whether it makes you well known or not, will be forgotten within a few generations, correct?
Is that what this is about? How when you end, your life and potential is finite?
Does that scare you or what?
Thanks for reading and i wish for a small discussion or at least a reply (if you dont mind)
furthermore, id like to apologise for my headstrong and argumentative opinions/views which i displayed in my earlier comments. That night i was in an argumentative and irritable mood and displayed a side of me which really doesnt come out much and sort of typed without engaging my brain and thinking.
I personally wouldn't worry about such things as what you said in this Blog. Depressing thigs like that only waste the time you have here, and if you truly believe that there is no afterlife, then why waste time pondering such things?
What I wonder, though, is like you said. Everything has to have a beginning. How did God come to be, if he did? That's quite puzzling to me. Same with the universe. There are many things left to be solved, and maybe it's just better that these things are left unsolved. Having faith in something isn't really a bad thing, after all. If you feel like there's something waiting for you, better than where you are now, is that such a bad thing?
Anyway, have a Kudo, since it is interesting to ponder the things I've just said.
the title reminded of Devkota, who's considered to be the greatest poet of Nepal, who was an atheist all his life, and in his deathbed he said God exists.
I used to like Muse like 4 years ago when I bought Absolution on the day it came out. Good memories, but I wasn't a big fan though, I'm not a Muse fan at all now a days.
cool....my scoutmaster brought this up in my eagle scout prep conference yesterday. i used to think i was an atheist, but i decided that it's better to keep an open mind and simply wonder constantly about gods and stuff, rather than tying yourself to one belief.
Ya, that was awesome. I haven't heard that song, guess I'll check it out. I just lost my grandpa, and until that day I never truely thought about death and what it meant. That expereince completely shattered my world...and every day I roll some thoughts around in my head for a second...anyways...thanks for your post and kudos!
well, you certainly are thorough , I wouldn't worry though, i believe that whatever happens happens, and if there is a god, I certainly won't like my odds on meeting him
Damn, that was deep... I think about this kind of stuff all the time... I used to, anyway.
"In the end. I believe that what you believe in changes the Universe for you. Specifically, if we just say there are 6 billion people on Earth, then there are 6 billion different versions of the Universe. For example, if you didn't know Australia existed, and you'd never been there, nor anyone told you, would it exist? It wouldn't. But to someone else, who did know about it, it would exist. Therefore, if you believe in life after death or something, then sure, it happens. But if you've never heard of the concept then nothing happens."
That was pretty good, except towards the end where you dwindled into the "our purpose is to pass on DNA" theory, which was less than I expected of you. I was hoping you'd say something more philosophical and less biological. After all, if there's no purpose to our living, there is no purpose to our offspring living, and therefore evolution cannot be accepted as a purpose, merely a happening. I still give it a kudo though.
And by the way, I regularly think about what I'd do if I found out I was going to die next week, in a year, in ten minutes, or at the end of the current tomorrow. I don't know why, but Thoughts Of A Dying Atheist is one of my favourite tracks on that album too... Maybe there's a link?
^As bad as I am at science, I have a few thoughts which are based more on theories and logic rather than thought alone. That said, this is a very old piece of writing.
This blog gets masses of approval from me. Delving right into the heart of the nature of logic there.
Quoting T.S. Eliot is also awesome worthy, I wrote about Prufrock in my last literature essay, got a surprisingly good mark. It's very open to interpretation; I've always thought that quote you used was a comment on the indecisiveness, timidity and general lack of grandeur of modern man. But your reading puts it in a new light altogether.
Yes and no. I'd like to say no - death is what happens, and you're not going to avoid it. But also yes, because I currently very much like being alive.
Excellent piece there. I totally understand what you say. How can you become nothing if were all set up to be ourselves which, when you think about it through is a miracle in itself. To take another Harry Potter quote, we are living miracles "Body, Nerve and Bonding Heart". Think of someone you love so much and the thought of them going is the thing that will give you nightmares. Its just if you believe in nothing after death, then in essence your damning them to nothingness. But in all, I dont believe in specifics of peoples opinions of god or a god, I just want to believe to myself, that if the worst were to happen to people I love, then I'll just accept it's ok, and theyre safe. For instance, I love my girlfriend so much, and for some reason one of the only thoughts that go through my head are how happy I am shes there but also things like, what if she dies tomorrow..or the day after and everytime I do, all I imagine is finding nothing.
All I've learned from thinking that is I could not take it. Same thought I have about my family, mother, father everyone. But the clincher...it's gonna happen, and when it does, all I want is to find any love I have here to comfort me and for me to return the favour to them. Sorry I sorta ranted here but I found your piece above at a very weird time. And I love Muse too btw
Just removed some shitty comments from a guy who felt like dissing it
To be honest this isn't here for criticism or to be asked 'what the Hell is wrong with [me]'. It's here as a display of my views and discussion with people who like to keep it respectful.
it's random coincidence we are here, but we may as well make the most of it. it humbles me to think about it. i've also been scared of dying since i was like 5. not cool.
I know I'm slow on the uptake by close to a month on this, but kudos. I've thought about the fact that ceasing to exist means just that. You die and eventually so does your memory and anything that states you even existed to begin with. If that's so, is there a real point in existing at all? Well you've got me thinking, and now I won't be able to sleep tonight. Good read either way, and what you said about DNA has me reminiscing about the video we watched on the discovery of DNA for biology today. Pretty interesting story, actually.
You write extremely deeply.
Your muse (no pun intended) strikes a particular chord (no pun... again) with me - as a long time Christian, I look at this situation from the other side of the metaphorical fence.
A while back I became convinced I was going to die - I had a chest operation and prior to going into hospital there was a point when there was no doubt in my mind that I was going to die. I didn't fear death, more I feared being parted from my loved ones.
I think what you say about us not being creatures of understanding and knowledge is absolutely true. We're all just dust and bones in the end - we flatter ourself to think anything different.
I have had the same thoughts not so long ago. Still haven't solved the Mystery of Universe, but I know now why were the people in the past so religious. Without the entertainment we've got now they had all the time to ponder on this, so if they didn't want to go nuts they had to believe in something. I have no fears of death, but I do fear NOTHINGNESS. It scares me sometimes when the lights go out in the night...
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